I never like blaming MB, but I don't think he got the formation right on saturday. Three at the back only really works when we have Philips available. I appreciate that Forshaw is only back from injury, but the midfield needed reinforcing, and if that meant moving Shackleton to CM or DCM and playing Drameh at RB, then that's what was needed. Forshaw and Shackleton in the middle with Klich playing in an advanced number 10 role would instantly improve the spine and provide support to the forwards. It means taking a risk and playing a newbie in Drameh or, even Hjelde on as LB and Dallas at RB, or I think McKinstry has played as a full back on occasions in the past, but that's what the u23s are there for - to provide competition for places. Much better IMHO to play a rookie at full back than concede the midfield.
Words fail me after watching that tripe last saturday.
If this game teaches us anything it has to be we need PL quality in the squad available if the likes of rapha & Kalvin are missing. I didnt see one player wanting to drive the team the on (ala batty, milner, henderson) a player that knuckles down sets the tempo and kick starts the engine in midfield. Lackluster and down right un-acceptable was that against lets face it a poor Southampton side.
People saying "blip", "players out", "it will be fine", im sorry guys but how does a team that performed so admirably last season (5 months ago) play with freedom, fight to the end, passion, desire serve up that dross???
Yes ok Kalvin and rapha are different gravy but ffs thats two players, i thought only 2 players James & Cooper showed honesty of effort and we got stuffed, ZERO shots on target???? Like thats just pliss poor for any professional football team to end up with after 90mins of football, ZERO shots on target???? its not as if we were playing Brazil of Italy ffs. I wont say we played Southfu*kinghampton on Saturday we took to the field thats about the size of it.
We are very lucky not to be in the drop zone this morning we need points and need them badly otherwise if we are relegated it could be another 16 years before we get back. and by then an ESL could well be formed!!!!
by no means do we need to panic but most of us were around when the "Leeds are too big of a Club to go down" comments were out and if we dont sort things quickly we could be facing 7 or 8 six-pointers and must win games which we all know when the pressure comes on we dont tend to cope with that too well, plus i can imagine a few dodgy "VAR" calls or not going against us.
I have noticed we are going longer quicker and more vertically when a team presses us high up.
We do not seem to have that old confidence to pass between the lines. NO decent 40 yard cross field balls to the wings, just a hit and hope from back to front
Wolves will do the same and have real speed up top. Their incredible hulk will have a field day if there is no KP.
Rodrigo and Roberts are a waste of a shirt. Put Gelhardt and Bate in. They have something to prove.
Not sure what Dallas problem is but he is nowhere near the player he was last year.
IMO Coops was our best player. Don't get the stick he gets.
As for James, he needs another 30 days under MB, put Jimmy in.
We were shite v Saints. Playing the kids would have been no worse. At least they would have put some effort in.
I really can only hope KP and Rafa are back this weekend otherwise it will be another long day at the office. Does not look like Ayling, Koch, Firpo or Bamford will return but they have a chance. MB is trying the plan B of hit and hope, lets play football on the floor.
Apologies if there was a misunderstanding Belgian - my point was Koch is first cover for Phillips rather than Struijk, who is not a DM. I never said Koch was as good as Phillips or that we don't need better in that area.
Another quick word about Cooper's performance yesterday, miles ahead of anybody else? No he wasn't, best defender and player was Shacks, to me MILES ahead of the overrated & payed bunch (incl. Cooper, who was our 2e best defender but our 2e best player).
That's not saying a lot because most were just rubbish.
It was thoroughly depressing being there yesterday, the whole experience, stupidly long queues to get in leading to a few fans missing the start and a bit of a scuffle as some fans pushed in. Rubbish team line up and horrifically bad performance. Queues for the bog at half time took ages, for a modern stadium it was naff. Rubbish atmosphere due to the lacklustre Rubbish on the pitch, it would have taken more than the fans to raise that shower
Don't have anything against Coops, and never will have a bad word to say about him either.
He's a great person, and good player who'll always give his all for the club.
Some (myself incl.) didn't agree with him that yesterday we improved after the break, because there just was nothing to improve upon.
My biggest worry now is not that players like Philips and Raphina will leave for big box, but plain simply that they'll have there mind made up about going, no matter what.
"He's a great overall captain of our team" Really? If he was as good as we believe why the fck was he not dishing out boll*ckings to the underperforming dross on the field??. I didn't seem him once complain to any of the other players to get their fingers out and put a shift in. As he is our current captain we will stick by him, no real choice, but whatever the stats say, he is becoming a liability and going back to the old Cooper. Maybe it will all turnaround when we are at full strength, we will see.
My biggest fear at the moment is that the likes of Phillips and Raphinha will be on the big clubs shopping lists come January. If we haven't turned it around by then, pretty sure they will be off for big money!
@1972Glory bloody Newcastle will be offering them 300k a week and a gold pig. Can't see them leaving in Jan though but highly likely at the end of the season whether we go down or just stay up.
Fair enough Smurf and I haven't seen those stats which look good for Coops....
I just think he's always got a mistake in him, going to give needless free kicks and pens away etc....
However I have to hold my hands up after seeing those stats and I'd definitely have him as one of the 4 CBs needed....
He's a great overall captain of our team and does a lot of work in the community but I just think I'd rather have a fully fit Llorente and Koch as CB partnership.... ideally you'd want a right and left footer though.
I still stick with Struijk and Cooper fighting for the LCB role. I prefer Struijk long term - he's definitely NOT a Phillips cover - that should be Koch.
Why pick on Cooper? He was our best player yesterday - by a long way, and has been outstanding all season. The Mirror rate him as the 9th best performing defender in the premiership.
Number 2 according to https://dataviz.theanalyst.com/season-reviews/2021/
He's 7th in the list of passes made, according to the EPL
He's won more aerial battles than any other Leeds player, 33 in fact - double anybody else. And he's started more sequences from the back than any other premiership defender.
He's arguably been our most valuable player this season, along with Meslier and Raph. And he's first name on the teamsheet, And rightly so. If there is one player that deserves the respect of the fans, it's our captain.
Well I must apologise for the dross served up and fully expected to be in the MDT for a few more games.... we should be SMASHING teams like Watford and Soton.
Coops is not good enough for the Prem....
Dallas is only a squad player this season and shouldn't be starting based on his performances....
Is Strujik good enough to cover for Kalvin? Don't think so....
Klich is not good enough to play in the Prem....
Rodrigo is so hit and miss and inconsistent....
Roberts is embarrassingly poor and I wouldn't even want him to play for Luton in the Championship. What does a manager with a reputation worldwide see in a player like him!? Fair enough and he gave him a chance based on potential but this is fkn stupid now. Roberts has a good work ethic but ANY player should have that.... even a Division 29 player in parks team football!!
Geldhart can't be any good if he can't get in ahead of Roberts....
When you have important players like Kalvin, Raphinha and Bamford out added to 5 crap players in the starting line up then it's no wonder we lost!
I think Soopa said we had our longest away trip after the international break and not fair.... I'm just glad we were playing Soton instead of one of the top 6!!
Sill looks like a wasted opportunity to test out our younger players at the end of last season. We still played the same squad at full tilt. No rest. No rotation.
Bielsa’s 18 pool of first teamers is the major problem for me. At the end of last season he persisted with Costa and Alioski when we knew they’d be out the door in the Summer. Forshaw seems to have seamlessly slipped into that group now despite him never exactly pulling up trees in the Championship.Bate must be thinking how that has happened!
Turned off the game after 70 mins. Could not bare to watch it. Worst performance I have seen us put in for 3+ years.
There is no point in picking Roberts or Rodrigo. Dallas is a pale shadow of the player he has been. It really would have been better putting Gelhardt, Greenwood and Drameh in as they could not have been worse.
Pumping the high balls into the box and guess what, we lose it. The midfield today was non existent.
So it take the master 80 minutes to work our Roberts is completely crap and then sends on Gelhardt for the last 15 and Summerville for the last 10, what's the bloody point!!.
"And Captain Coops thought we played well in 2nd half".
Well he certainly wasn't at the game where I was!!. Absolute sh*te. As soon as the line up was confirmed, I knew we were in trouble. We have never played well with a back 3 and again today it was shown in bucket loads. Roberts and Rodrigo should donate their salaries to charity, never have I seen a poorer pair of players as those two.
Since Dallas was caught out playing away from home, his form has completely gone to pieces and is a shadow of the player over the last 2 seasons.
We seem to have the smallest squad height wise in the Premiership, but because our brains appear to be scrambled, keep on puming
It’s the dire individual performances that worry me the most!
OK, we’ve only had half a team for most of the season, but the majority of our regular first team starters have been well below par and don’t look like the same players as last season. Scary!!
Danish, I wouldn't go as far in saying MB has lost it.
But as you say he sticks to his guns/concept nomatter the personel that's available, and on top of that he's very loyal/ towards his players.
Him being that stubborn at times seemingly prevents him from making the required replacements.
But being honest, in terms of the quality available to us in center midfield, I do feel that without Philips, our engine room must rate amongst the weakest in the Premiership. In pre-season we were blown away more often than not, with alarmbells ringing out everywhere. Board and management disregarded those.
Did we really expect that without Philips, the likes of Klich, Koch, Struijk, Roberts and the unfortunate Forshaw would be good enough to actually compete in the Premiership? Apart from Klich (near or at his best) I would say that none of them are premiership quality in that position.
Even someone like Dallas is far better/effective in other positions (today was the worst i've seem him albeit at LB/Left Wing Back).
I do hope and believe that with the return of Philips, Raphina and a scoring Bamford we'll have enough to survive.
However, I can't see us being much better/effective than 5 or 6 teams.
Don't think the board needs to focus on expanding ER just yet.
Let’s take a breath for a moment..... 5 or 6 of the first 11 picks out injured, (and some for a few weeks now)? Maybe there isn’t enough depth in the squad but very few teams would cope with that. Let’s get some of these back (soon) and then see where we are.
I honestly think that Bielsa has lost it. Where we played fast and entertaining last season, we look slow and uninspired this season. We may need the inspiration on the training ground from Pablo. But the main thing is that Bielsa cannot once again make the championship level players perform at PL level. Even worse: his extreme loyalty to Cooper, Dallas, Ayling, Roberts, Klich, Forshaw makes it impossible to introduce younger and better players. Obviously, the responsibility is also AR’s because we did not get the playmaker we so badly needed during summer, but it’s difficult not to see Bielsa‘s loyalty slash stubbornness as part of the problem.
So, we get the longest away trip of the season straight after the Intl. games.
Meslier
- Fresh
Ayling
- Injured
Firpo
- Unavailable
Llorente
- Just back from Injury
Cooper
- Just back from Intl Games
Struijk
- Just back from Suspension
Koch
- Injured
Phillips
- Injured
Forshaw
- Just back from Injury
Klich
- Just back from Intl Games
Dallas
- Just back from Intl Games
Shackleton
- Fresh
Harrison
- Fresh
Raphinha
- Unavailable
James
- Just back from Intl Games
Roberts
- Just back from Intl Games
Rodrigo
- Fresh
Bamford
- Injured
Just 4 players fresh and one back from suspension out of position. Of those fresh players 3 were our best players and the other let us down badly. Not a shock we lost, but the manner of the defeat was very frustrating.
We have to go again, pick ourselves up and get on with it.
We know we should have beaten Toon and the Hammers, so despite todays dire performance, with the main players back, we'll improve. But the thinness of the squad is sobering.
Dallas as poor as I've ever seen him with Harrison & James both having just the one decent action. Shacks about the only one that can hold his head high.
Distraugth!
Said it in pre-season, that the midfield area needed reinforcements.
We need to get something from this game and MB decides to bring on Forshaw??? I have to question why when we've been so poor there is still no room for any of the young lads. More than just a bit strange.
I still believe Norwich and Watford are worse - then it's down to us, Burnley, Palace and this lot beating us up...... can't rely on Toon bailing us out any more.
The good news of course is that we look like we'll get nothing, but an arse ball or a bum own goal could yet get us something we don't deserve - can't be any worse in the second half can we??
First time back in a football stadium for a long while, so looking forward to it. The line up will be interesting. Bielsa, as mentioned, is very loyal to his players so despite Cooper's failings, he will still be at the back with Llorente although I think Cresswell is a class act and should be playing.
Pace is also key so Shacks should be in the side and hopefully a welcome return for Harrison with James on the other wing.
Upfront, well you never know, don't be surprised if Roberts is picked over Rodrigo, again I don't think any of these 2 deserve the position. Gelhardt most have the patience of a saint!!.
Paddy, Ayling, Koch out. KP could play, Rafa being flown back to UK in private jet with other Prem players so there is an outside chance he could feature, if only from the bench, Dallas, Forshaw and Summerville available.
Looks like Luke and Patrick are at least a fortnight away from being fit, Koch another month probably.
Dont like 3 CBs as I think it stifles us in attack. Would prefer KP to drop back there if needed.
Not sure Ralph will start with 2 up top either. Adams is out so I would expect just Armstrong leading the line with Walcott and Tella either side and Redmond in the No10 hole. Am sure they will be set up as a 4-2-3-1 to start with and only go to 2 up top if they ae losing with 15/20 mins to play.
Saints will look for an early goal then sit back and be "professional". We score first and they will have to come out and play which could allow us space to create.
We need the win. So I hope Top Cat can keep his run going. Let Benny the Ball, Spook, Choo Choo and the others from Hoagy's Alley run rings around Officer Dibble again!
This game, and all the rest, hinges on WHEN the ref will start giving pens against Coops for holding /tugging /pulling/grappling /shagging his marker when defending set pieces.... he's somehow got away with it so far so will continue to do it until penalised.
Just NUDGE your marker off balance and WIN the fkn header....!!
Thats all fine and dandy in theory BB but no team no matter how wide the gulf in class will have the ball for the 90 mins. And lets call it as it is Saints and ourselves are about on parity atm.
I admire any coach / manager that stick by their playing philosophy but the down side to playing the same way, with the same formation, the same players, opposition managers find a way to pick holes in our set-up.
The mid-table and teams at drop zone last year proved this, they sat back and tried to expose coopers lack of pace at the back, or they waited for a set-piece, long throw, corner, etc. Thankfully we came out on top in alot of those games and nicked a few 3 points in games this season we have only managed a draw. These next few games are all winnable in my eyes (even the spuds game) but we need to mix things up, dont do the predicted thing that the opposition has been working on in training sessions beforehand, and play a little bit off the cuff. Key to this tho is rotating players and making the substitutions when needed. We know MB can make the difficult calls when a player is called ashore after picking up a yellow card early in a game (Pascal springs to mind 23rd min??), but all above said i wouldnt want any other manager at LUFC, i just love the guy and his honesty of effort, plus his high moral standards, just think of it if more people had Marcelo's principles / values just think how good the world would be.
Back to football
I like Smurfs suggestion of playing JS ahead of Klich in his formation but i cant see the master running with it (we all know he is very loyal to the players that give him all they have and tbf Klich falls into that category).
Despite ROI have 2 wins in the latest games of international football im really glad the PL fixtures are back.
I think we will start with 4-1-4-1 and KP will end up dropping as 3d CB if needed.
Baby Shacks deserves and should start. Saints have a lot of pace up top so his speed is needed.
If we keep the ball for 90 minutes, then it does not matter which formation we play! There is only one ball. We get it, we keep it, they can then just keep running around.
The word on the street is that we might play three at the back as Southampton normally play two strikers, which is good news for Struijk, however it could be at the expense of Shackleton with Dallas at right wing back and Klich in the advanced midfield role. To me, that would be depressingly unfair. I would square the circle by keeping Dallas at right wing back, but play Shackleton as the attacking midfielder. It's not a role Klich has particularly excelled at this year and he can always come on as super sub. When a young player is excelling as Jamie has been, he needs supported with a run in the team. And I think it's the best chance for a win.
i dont think you wont be too far wrong with that lineup, hopefully the international break wont have broken the Clubs momentum and "if" we can manage another win i can see us gradually moving away from the drop zone.
Lets hope for a fair ref and that we arent talking about VAR or blatant bias against us at 5 o clock on Saturday
Well Rafa will not be playing so it looks like James on the right and Jack on the left. Rodrigo up top with Bamford on Bench. No Luke so Shacks at RB - which I prefer!. Llorente and hopefully Struijk as CBs but Cooper likely to get nod at LCB.
Phillips, Dallas and Kitch in CM with Firpo at LB and Meslier in goal.
Bench may be a bit stronger - Roberts Bamford Summerville and Cresswell with more than 2 games experience!
Nice thread and good throwback to the old days. I remember going to the Dell and seeing Bridges get a hat-trick and also Bowyer score in the last few mins in another game down here. Also remember shopping in Soton and seeing us come back from 3-0 down thanks to a TV in Rumbelows window display
So I managed to spawn a couple of tickets for me and the boy and hoping to see us confidently take a 2-0 lead and then hang on for a scruffy 2-1 win…
Much and all as we love Bill, Shacks is the future and tbf to the guy he played well in the Watford game. He has more pace than Ayling, something the saints forwards have in spades so i think JS should remain in the jersey for this one and try and keep any enforced injury replacements to a minimum
I would be looking to play Shackleton in DCM, of everybody who has played there so far, he's shown by far the most aptitude. It will almost certainly be Struijk though as to do otherwise would mean altering multiple positions, e.g. Dallas to RB, Klich to CM, Rodrigo to No 10 and Roberts up front.
TBH with Ayling out and having watched the U23's I'd be tempted to leave Shacks at RB and give him an extended run. Bring Lewis Bate in for a crack at it, or just ask Klich to sit a bit deeper
Unfortunately I won't be going Lord Breezyballs as Stan is playing on bloody Saturday afternoon's now.... we will be applying for tickets on Thursday at 1pm for the Arsenal game if they're still on sale to gold members!!
Meet you then if you are going? I will be able to get tickets for the Arsenal end if not as a couple of mates are season ticket holders but I don't know if I really want to go in their end and sitting on my hands.... I suppose I'll be surrounded by other Leeds supporters though!! 👍🙈🤣😉
@TC10 I'm giving the cup game a miss mate what with Southampton Norwich Brighton Chelsea and spuds coming up.
Not a massive fan of the Emirates anyway, last time I went we were in lower tier right at the back in the corner, worst view I've had of a game for ages, ended up turning round and watching the action on a TV.
Excellent TC a vastly improved effort, top job mate.
seeing as the game wont kick off until 16th October even my long range weather forecast apparatus cant see that far, early indications are by the way the grass is growing it will be mild for the time of year but no brolly need as it wont rain that weekend.
If the game was on this weekend id be confident of bagging another 3 points but seeing as those dreaded internationals are on anything could happen, players picking up injuries, having to self isolate, etc
This MDT could go into the history books with 623123123324534523 views, and might be on page 23 with all the comments (and thats BEFORE) the game kicks off😉
Better MDT than your first effort. I assume you were sober this time. I dont mind it being so early as England V Andorra hardly excites.
I can now spend a bit of time thinking about a real game that matters.
I wish you luck my friend and please ensure you seek out the Gaelic Bull God to ensure we have the luck of the leprechauns this game too.
Saints will press us high up the pitch so we need to be able to pass/break between their lines. Rodrigo looks a more complete striker than young Pat so I would expect him to keep his place with Hattrick on the bench if he has recovered enough.
Baby Shacks has earned the RB spot. Ayling might soon be wondering if he will ever get a game again.
Llorente is immense which is a shame for Charlie.
We wont have Rafa for this game as he will no doubt have to self isolate or, with the travel time, not be quite match fit to start. James looked more than decent on the left v Watford so maybe Jackie will then start on the right.
Expect Dallas to be fit as he is a warrior. If not I would put Bate in there and play him alongside KP. Both as No6s but given the licence to move into a No8 position as and when whilst the other one holds. Similar to England with KP and Rice.
Saints have pace up top as did Watford but Ward-Prowse will be a big miss for them.
Jeez, I didn't realise that this game is 2wks away as England are playing a massive game v the ski instructor's and waiters from Andorra next weekend.... this makes this the earliest MDT ever and will be long forgotten about by the time of the game.
Nothing goes on in Southampton so I'll add bits in the following days, bore you with a couple of stories about the place and make the rest up....
I played at Southampton's old ground, The Dell, in the Hampshire Senior Cup Final and it was the worst pitch ever and full of big holes and divots....don't know how Le Tissier looked so good on it! And we got stuffed 3-0!
I went to a Southampton v Leeds game about 20yrs ago but wasn't able to get tickets....we went down to our hotel anyway as it was booked. We got the ferry over to the Isle of Wight for a day trip and when we got back to the hotel the Leeds players coach was in the car park... we went in and the Leeds players were everywhere in tracksuits! After a couple of drinks I got brave and politely asked a table of players if anyone had any spare tickets. Dom Matteo said he had 2 and handed them over free and we sat with the players wives etc.... can't remember the score though!
Next morning as we came out of our hotel door for breakfast, Milner and Bakke came out of the room opposite and we went down in the lift with them. I remember Milner was very spotty and shy and Bakke had fkn massive ears....
I remember Viduka oddly sitting at a table by himself reading a newspaper. I'm sure Ivan Bravo was also there who I think got caught up with employing someone to kill somebody for him a couple of years ago.... is that correct or just the voices in my head!?
Southampton is famous for :
The Titanic sailing from here on it's fateful maiden voyage....
Onions were invented here....
The Spitfire plane was built here....
There are 8 other Southamptons in the world.... 6 in the USA and 2 in Canada. If you are travelling to the game make sure you put the right one in your sat nav....
Famous people from Southampton include:
Tit touching sexcase Benny Hill....
Some of the Chuckle Brothers....
Craig David who met a girl on Monday, took her for drink on Tuesday and was riding her on the Wednesday....
3 footed pilot Douglas Bader....
John Terry's best mate Wayne Bridge....
Non bra wearer Charlie Dimmock....
Howard Jones who'd like to get to know you well....
Jona Lewie who you'd find in a kitchen at party's....
Fat arrssed Luke Shaw who needs to find some shorts that fit....
It looked like we were back to last seasons form v WatfordScum so I'm going for a positive 3-0 victory with a Hattrick Bamford hat trick. I assume he'll be fit as the game is 2wks away and I think Bielsa will put him straight back in. If he'd have been fit yesterday I'm sure we'd have won by 3/4 and he'd have scored a couple....
I would rather play kids than established players that do f all.
Dallas, Roberts and Rodrigo should be ashamed of themselves.
Coops is never going to be a vocal leader as was Strachs. He played well v Saints as did Baby Shacks. It is just the others that let them down.
No midfield showing for the ball? Hoofs up the field?
Saints was painful to watch and I gave up after 70 mins
Give me Jimmy over Fanny Games. I just want a winger to run and destroy
£25 million wasted.
God I could cry!!!!
I never like blaming MB, but I don't think he got the formation right on saturday. Three at the back only really works when we have Philips available. I appreciate that Forshaw is only back from injury, but the midfield needed reinforcing, and if that meant moving Shackleton to CM or DCM and playing Drameh at RB, then that's what was needed. Forshaw and Shackleton in the middle with Klich playing in an advanced number 10 role would instantly improve the spine and provide support to the forwards. It means taking a risk and playing a newbie in Drameh or, even Hjelde on as LB and Dallas at RB, or I think McKinstry has played as a full back on occasions in the past, but that's what the u23s are there for - to provide competition for places. Much better IMHO to play a rookie at full back than concede the midfield.
Words fail me after watching that tripe last saturday.
If this game teaches us anything it has to be we need PL quality in the squad available if the likes of rapha & Kalvin are missing. I didnt see one player wanting to drive the team the on (ala batty, milner, henderson) a player that knuckles down sets the tempo and kick starts the engine in midfield. Lackluster and down right un-acceptable was that against lets face it a poor Southampton side.
People saying "blip", "players out", "it will be fine", im sorry guys but how does a team that performed so admirably last season (5 months ago) play with freedom, fight to the end, passion, desire serve up that dross???
Yes ok Kalvin and rapha are different gravy but ffs thats two players, i thought only 2 players James & Cooper showed honesty of effort and we got stuffed, ZERO shots on target???? Like thats just pliss poor for any professional football team to end up with after 90mins of football, ZERO shots on target???? its not as if we were playing Brazil of Italy ffs. I wont say we played Southfu*kinghampton on Saturday we took to the field thats about the size of it.
We are very lucky not to be in the drop zone this morning we need points and need them badly otherwise if we are relegated it could be another 16 years before we get back. and by then an ESL could well be formed!!!!
by no means do we need to panic but most of us were around when the "Leeds are too big of a Club to go down" comments were out and if we dont sort things quickly we could be facing 7 or 8 six-pointers and must win games which we all know when the pressure comes on we dont tend to cope with that too well, plus i can imagine a few dodgy "VAR" calls or not going against us.
Soopaleeds, no apologies needed at all! I was only joking or trying to.
Sorry if that came over the wrong way.
I know and agree with you that Koch is MB's first option to replace Kalvin.
I do rate Koch as a CB and feel he can do a job in midfield to shut things down and see out a game.
Having Koch & Pascal as first and second stand ins for Kalvin is what worries me.
A fully fit Forshaw could perhaps be a better option but he's obviously still a long way off getting towards full matchfitness.
I have noticed we are going longer quicker and more vertically when a team presses us high up.
We do not seem to have that old confidence to pass between the lines. NO decent 40 yard cross field balls to the wings, just a hit and hope from back to front
Wolves will do the same and have real speed up top. Their incredible hulk will have a field day if there is no KP.
Rodrigo and Roberts are a waste of a shirt. Put Gelhardt and Bate in. They have something to prove.
Not sure what Dallas problem is but he is nowhere near the player he was last year.
IMO Coops was our best player. Don't get the stick he gets.
As for James, he needs another 30 days under MB, put Jimmy in.
We were shite v Saints. Playing the kids would have been no worse. At least they would have put some effort in.
I really can only hope KP and Rafa are back this weekend otherwise it will be another long day at the office. Does not look like Ayling, Koch, Firpo or Bamford will return but they have a chance. MB is trying the plan B of hit and hope, lets play football on the floor.
Soopaleeds, if Koch turns out to be the cover for Philips, prepare 'thy' for championship football sooner than expected.
Good news is that in turn I'll gladly cover for Koch, with or without Pubic/Pelvic injury.
andyl, great points about Alioski & Costa.
Another quick word about Cooper's performance yesterday, miles ahead of anybody else? No he wasn't, best defender and player was Shacks, to me MILES ahead of the overrated & payed bunch (incl. Cooper, who was our 2e best defender but our 2e best player).
That's not saying a lot because most were just rubbish.
It was thoroughly depressing being there yesterday, the whole experience, stupidly long queues to get in leading to a few fans missing the start and a bit of a scuffle as some fans pushed in. Rubbish team line up and horrifically bad performance. Queues for the bog at half time took ages, for a modern stadium it was naff. Rubbish atmosphere due to the lacklustre Rubbish on the pitch, it would have taken more than the fans to raise that shower
Weather was nice though, as I probably predicted.
Don't have anything against Coops, and never will have a bad word to say about him either.
He's a great person, and good player who'll always give his all for the club.
Some (myself incl.) didn't agree with him that yesterday we improved after the break, because there just was nothing to improve upon.
My biggest worry now is not that players like Philips and Raphina will leave for big box, but plain simply that they'll have there mind made up about going, no matter what.
"He's a great overall captain of our team" Really? If he was as good as we believe why the fck was he not dishing out boll*ckings to the underperforming dross on the field??. I didn't seem him once complain to any of the other players to get their fingers out and put a shift in. As he is our current captain we will stick by him, no real choice, but whatever the stats say, he is becoming a liability and going back to the old Cooper. Maybe it will all turnaround when we are at full strength, we will see.
My biggest fear at the moment is that the likes of Phillips and Raphinha will be on the big clubs shopping lists come January. If we haven't turned it around by then, pretty sure they will be off for big money!
Fair enough Smurf and I haven't seen those stats which look good for Coops....
I just think he's always got a mistake in him, going to give needless free kicks and pens away etc....
However I have to hold my hands up after seeing those stats and I'd definitely have him as one of the 4 CBs needed....
He's a great overall captain of our team and does a lot of work in the community but I just think I'd rather have a fully fit Llorente and Koch as CB partnership.... ideally you'd want a right and left footer though.
Why pick on Cooper? He was our best player yesterday - by a long way, and has been outstanding all season. The Mirror rate him as the 9th best performing defender in the premiership.
https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/premier-league-top-defenders-202122-25188849
He's 9th in the list of tackles made (EPL), https://www.premierleague.com/stats
Number 2 according to https://dataviz.theanalyst.com/season-reviews/2021/
He's 7th in the list of passes made, according to the EPL
He's won more aerial battles than any other Leeds player, 33 in fact - double anybody else. And he's started more sequences from the back than any other premiership defender.
He's arguably been our most valuable player this season, along with Meslier and Raph. And he's first name on the teamsheet, And rightly so. If there is one player that deserves the respect of the fans, it's our captain.
Well I must apologise for the dross served up and fully expected to be in the MDT for a few more games.... we should be SMASHING teams like Watford and Soton.
Coops is not good enough for the Prem....
Dallas is only a squad player this season and shouldn't be starting based on his performances....
Is Strujik good enough to cover for Kalvin? Don't think so....
Klich is not good enough to play in the Prem....
Rodrigo is so hit and miss and inconsistent....
Roberts is embarrassingly poor and I wouldn't even want him to play for Luton in the Championship. What does a manager with a reputation worldwide see in a player like him!? Fair enough and he gave him a chance based on potential but this is fkn stupid now. Roberts has a good work ethic but ANY player should have that.... even a Division 29 player in parks team football!!
Geldhart can't be any good if he can't get in ahead of Roberts....
When you have important players like Kalvin, Raphinha and Bamford out added to 5 crap players in the starting line up then it's no wonder we lost!
I think Soopa said we had our longest away trip after the international break and not fair.... I'm just glad we were playing Soton instead of one of the top 6!!
Good luck to the next MDT....
Sill looks like a wasted opportunity to test out our younger players at the end of last season. We still played the same squad at full tilt. No rest. No rotation.
Bielsa’s 18 pool of first teamers is the major problem for me. At the end of last season he persisted with Costa and Alioski when we knew they’d be out the door in the Summer. Forshaw seems to have seamlessly slipped into that group now despite him never exactly pulling up trees in the Championship.Bate must be thinking how that has happened!
Agree Macwhite, said the same about Rodrigo on another thread.
If Barcelona come back in for him, cut our losses & let him go.
It's not gonna happen.
He looks out of sorts and his confidence seems completely shot.
1972glory, same here.
When I got that team news, i said to myself we're so lightweight and with the lack of an engine room... a draw was the best we could hope for.
Mind you didn't expect them to take us to the cleaners and back.
Don't know why/how Coops felt we did better in the second half.
But MB more or less said the same, something to the tune of "we didn't dominate but stopped them dominating us".
Yeah right. Clutching at straws...
BB, Rodrigo needs to go back to Spain. We have taken Spain’s centre forward and completely broken him ffs!
Turned off the game after 70 mins. Could not bare to watch it. Worst performance I have seen us put in for 3+ years.
There is no point in picking Roberts or Rodrigo. Dallas is a pale shadow of the player he has been. It really would have been better putting Gelhardt, Greenwood and Drameh in as they could not have been worse.
Pumping the high balls into the box and guess what, we lose it. The midfield today was non existent.
So it take the master 80 minutes to work our Roberts is completely crap and then sends on Gelhardt for the last 15 and Summerville for the last 10, what's the bloody point!!.
"And Captain Coops thought we played well in 2nd half".
Well he certainly wasn't at the game where I was!!. Absolute sh*te. As soon as the line up was confirmed, I knew we were in trouble. We have never played well with a back 3 and again today it was shown in bucket loads. Roberts and Rodrigo should donate their salaries to charity, never have I seen a poorer pair of players as those two.
Since Dallas was caught out playing away from home, his form has completely gone to pieces and is a shadow of the player over the last 2 seasons.
We seem to have the smallest squad height wise in the Premiership, but because our brains appear to be scrambled, keep on puming
That was imo the worst team effort I have seen their were a few boos at the end of the game
....And Captain Coops thought we played well in 2nd half.......
It’s the dire individual performances that worry me the most!
OK, we’ve only had half a team for most of the season, but the majority of our regular first team starters have been well below par and don’t look like the same players as last season. Scary!!
Danish, I wouldn't go as far in saying MB has lost it.
But as you say he sticks to his guns/concept nomatter the personel that's available, and on top of that he's very loyal/ towards his players.
Him being that stubborn at times seemingly prevents him from making the required replacements.
But being honest, in terms of the quality available to us in center midfield, I do feel that without Philips, our engine room must rate amongst the weakest in the Premiership. In pre-season we were blown away more often than not, with alarmbells ringing out everywhere. Board and management disregarded those.
Did we really expect that without Philips, the likes of Klich, Koch, Struijk, Roberts and the unfortunate Forshaw would be good enough to actually compete in the Premiership? Apart from Klich (near or at his best) I would say that none of them are premiership quality in that position.
Even someone like Dallas is far better/effective in other positions (today was the worst i've seem him albeit at LB/Left Wing Back).
I do hope and believe that with the return of Philips, Raphina and a scoring Bamford we'll have enough to survive.
However, I can't see us being much better/effective than 5 or 6 teams.
Don't think the board needs to focus on expanding ER just yet.
Let’s take a breath for a moment..... 5 or 6 of the first 11 picks out injured, (and some for a few weeks now)? Maybe there isn’t enough depth in the squad but very few teams would cope with that. Let’s get some of these back (soon) and then see where we are.
Very very poor showing today. Any other decent team would have sunk us 4/5/6 nil
Gonna cry a bit more into my pint now 😭
I honestly think that Bielsa has lost it. Where we played fast and entertaining last season, we look slow and uninspired this season. We may need the inspiration on the training ground from Pablo. But the main thing is that Bielsa cannot once again make the championship level players perform at PL level. Even worse: his extreme loyalty to Cooper, Dallas, Ayling, Roberts, Klich, Forshaw makes it impossible to introduce younger and better players. Obviously, the responsibility is also AR’s because we did not get the playmaker we so badly needed during summer, but it’s difficult not to see Bielsa‘s loyalty slash stubbornness as part of the problem.
So, we get the longest away trip of the season straight after the Intl. games.
Meslier
- Fresh
Ayling
- Injured
Firpo
- Unavailable
Llorente
- Just back from Injury
Cooper
- Just back from Intl Games
Struijk
- Just back from Suspension
Koch
- Injured
Phillips
- Injured
Forshaw
- Just back from Injury
Klich
- Just back from Intl Games
Dallas
- Just back from Intl Games
Shackleton
- Fresh
Harrison
- Fresh
Raphinha
- Unavailable
James
- Just back from Intl Games
Roberts
- Just back from Intl Games
Rodrigo
- Fresh
Bamford
- Injured
Just 4 players fresh and one back from suspension out of position. Of those fresh players 3 were our best players and the other let us down badly. Not a shock we lost, but the manner of the defeat was very frustrating.
We have to go again, pick ourselves up and get on with it.
WTF was that.
This had relegation written all over it.
It was really that bad.
Players liturally falling over their own feet.
Toothless performance.
Dallas as poor as I've ever seen him with Harrison & James both having just the one decent action. Shacks about the only one that can hold his head high.
Distraugth!
Said it in pre-season, that the midfield area needed reinforcements.
We're now paying the price.
Soop, plenty of other changes were possible and much sooner!!!
Summerville gets a go
I just said Rodrigo had been shite and that midfield has been non-existing.
But Forshaw not gonna score is he?
Gelhardt gets a go
We need to get something from this game and MB decides to bring on Forshaw??? I have to question why when we've been so poor there is still no room for any of the young lads. More than just a bit strange.
I still believe Norwich and Watford are worse - then it's down to us, Burnley, Palace and this lot beating us up...... can't rely on Toon bailing us out any more.
Plenty of options on the bench.
Still they can't be worse than most of those on the pitch.
Thing that's a bit reassuring is that they're at least 5 or 6 clubs worse than us, ...really?
How is Rodrigo still on the pitch? He's been shxte!
how wrong. We are worse. 🙄
A pub team performance, so far. Nearly everyone is having a bad day.
Hope springs eternal for the second half!
Some will point out we're losing the battle in midfield, but that's just not true.
There has not been a battle just because we totaly lack anything that even resembles a midfield.
Question remains why we've not added to our midfield ?
That's just simply beyond me.
Ouch. Not a great half.
The good news of course is that we look like we'll get nothing, but an arse ball or a bum own goal could yet get us something we don't deserve - can't be any worse in the second half can we??
That was PP.
Jeeez, very lucky to be at 0-0.
True we make them look outstanding, we even fall over our own feet.
Terrible performance.
Hope Southampton tire up a bit, but we seem to be already dead on our feet.
Saints winning every ball, the first & second, third...
Won't start naming any players yet, but boy have we been poor.
We are fookin dire! No wins in 10 for Saints and we’re making them look like fookin Champions!!😡
Under the cosh
Looks very lightweigth.
Would gladly take a point here.
Meslier, Shackleton, llorente, cooper, dallas, struijk, klich, Roberts, James, Harrison, rodrigo, no raphina phillips or firpo in squad
Meslier, Shackleton, llorente, cooper, dallas, struijk, klich, Roberts, James, Harrison, rodrigo, no raphina phillips or firpo in squad
First time back in a football stadium for a long while, so looking forward to it. The line up will be interesting. Bielsa, as mentioned, is very loyal to his players so despite Cooper's failings, he will still be at the back with Llorente although I think Cresswell is a class act and should be playing.
Pace is also key so Shacks should be in the side and hopefully a welcome return for Harrison with James on the other wing.
Upfront, well you never know, don't be surprised if Roberts is picked over Rodrigo, again I don't think any of these 2 deserve the position. Gelhardt most have the patience of a saint!!.
So good to be talking about real football! I hate international breaks!
F orshaw is available to play.
And Koch is in the US for a procedure.
@BB I agree that 3 centrebacks rarely works for us. I’d go with Llorente and Cresswell with Shackleton and Firpo/Dallas as full backs. MOT
Paddy, Ayling, Koch out. KP could play, Rafa being flown back to UK in private jet with other Prem players so there is an outside chance he could feature, if only from the bench, Dallas, Forshaw and Summerville available.
Looks like Luke and Patrick are at least a fortnight away from being fit, Koch another month probably.
Dont like 3 CBs as I think it stifles us in attack. Would prefer KP to drop back there if needed.
Not sure Ralph will start with 2 up top either. Adams is out so I would expect just Armstrong leading the line with Walcott and Tella either side and Redmond in the No10 hole. Am sure they will be set up as a 4-2-3-1 to start with and only go to 2 up top if they ae losing with 15/20 mins to play.
Saints will look for an early goal then sit back and be "professional". We score first and they will have to come out and play which could allow us space to create.
We need the win. So I hope Top Cat can keep his run going. Let Benny the Ball, Spook, Choo Choo and the others from Hoagy's Alley run rings around Officer Dibble again!
Latest news: Raphinha may play now - private jet return being organised for the Prem Brazilians.
Phillips due an assessment, Bamford, Koch and Bill still out
This game, and all the rest, hinges on WHEN the ref will start giving pens against Coops for holding /tugging /pulling/grappling /shagging his marker when defending set pieces.... he's somehow got away with it so far so will continue to do it until penalised.
Just NUDGE your marker off balance and WIN the fkn header....!!
Thats all fine and dandy in theory BB but no team no matter how wide the gulf in class will have the ball for the 90 mins. And lets call it as it is Saints and ourselves are about on parity atm.
I admire any coach / manager that stick by their playing philosophy but the down side to playing the same way, with the same formation, the same players, opposition managers find a way to pick holes in our set-up.
The mid-table and teams at drop zone last year proved this, they sat back and tried to expose coopers lack of pace at the back, or they waited for a set-piece, long throw, corner, etc. Thankfully we came out on top in alot of those games and nicked a few 3 points in games this season we have only managed a draw. These next few games are all winnable in my eyes (even the spuds game) but we need to mix things up, dont do the predicted thing that the opposition has been working on in training sessions beforehand, and play a little bit off the cuff. Key to this tho is rotating players and making the substitutions when needed. We know MB can make the difficult calls when a player is called ashore after picking up a yellow card early in a game (Pascal springs to mind 23rd min??), but all above said i wouldnt want any other manager at LUFC, i just love the guy and his honesty of effort, plus his high moral standards, just think of it if more people had Marcelo's principles / values just think how good the world would be.
Back to football
I like Smurfs suggestion of playing JS ahead of Klich in his formation but i cant see the master running with it (we all know he is very loyal to the players that give him all they have and tbf Klich falls into that category).
Despite ROI have 2 wins in the latest games of international football im really glad the PL fixtures are back.
Roll on Saturday.
Come on LEEDS
MOT
I think we will start with 4-1-4-1 and KP will end up dropping as 3d CB if needed.
Baby Shacks deserves and should start. Saints have a lot of pace up top so his speed is needed.
If we keep the ball for 90 minutes, then it does not matter which formation we play! There is only one ball. We get it, we keep it, they can then just keep running around.
The word on the street is that we might play three at the back as Southampton normally play two strikers, which is good news for Struijk, however it could be at the expense of Shackleton with Dallas at right wing back and Klich in the advanced midfield role. To me, that would be depressingly unfair. I would square the circle by keeping Dallas at right wing back, but play Shackleton as the attacking midfielder. It's not a role Klich has particularly excelled at this year and he can always come on as super sub. When a young player is excelling as Jamie has been, he needs supported with a run in the team. And I think it's the best chance for a win.
Waxing gibbous, the moon that is. High chance of rain in the afternoon , 14c.
@ BB
i dont think you wont be too far wrong with that lineup, hopefully the international break wont have broken the Clubs momentum and "if" we can manage another win i can see us gradually moving away from the drop zone.
Lets hope for a fair ref and that we arent talking about VAR or blatant bias against us at 5 o clock on Saturday
Got my ticket delivered today
Well Rafa will not be playing so it looks like James on the right and Jack on the left. Rodrigo up top with Bamford on Bench. No Luke so Shacks at RB - which I prefer!. Llorente and hopefully Struijk as CBs but Cooper likely to get nod at LCB.
Phillips, Dallas and Kitch in CM with Firpo at LB and Meslier in goal.
Bench may be a bit stronger - Roberts Bamford Summerville and Cresswell with more than 2 games experience!
Nice thread and good throwback to the old days. I remember going to the Dell and seeing Bridges get a hat-trick and also Bowyer score in the last few mins in another game down here. Also remember shopping in Soton and seeing us come back from 3-0 down thanks to a TV in Rumbelows window display
So I managed to spawn a couple of tickets for me and the boy and hoping to see us confidently take a 2-0 lead and then hang on for a scruffy 2-1 win…
Given our injuries and Brazil if I was MB I would go for:
Meslier
Shacks Llorente Cooper Firpo
KP
James Dallas Kitch Harrison
Rodrigo
Subs: KK, Struijk, Cresswell, Drameh, Summerville, Bamford, Roberts, Bate, Gelhardt
Much and all as we love Bill, Shacks is the future and tbf to the guy he played well in the Watford game. He has more pace than Ayling, something the saints forwards have in spades so i think JS should remain in the jersey for this one and try and keep any enforced injury replacements to a minimum
I would be looking to play Shackleton in DCM, of everybody who has played there so far, he's shown by far the most aptitude. It will almost certainly be Struijk though as to do otherwise would mean altering multiple positions, e.g. Dallas to RB, Klich to CM, Rodrigo to No 10 and Roberts up front.
Good luck mate 2-0 leeds win
Meaningless games v Andorra and Hungary.
England just need to beat Andorra to qualify in top spot for next year's World Cup. Even a 3rd team can win this one by 4-0.
Far better for KP to get over his niggle, have a bit of rest and return to proper football when the Prem restarts.
Kalvin replaced by Ward-Prowse in England squad for World Cup Qualifiers
Is this the start of it???
Cracking MDT TC, love the story too.
We will have to watch their pace but think we will get over the line with this one
2-1 to us James and Rodders
Unfortunately I won't be going Lord Breezyballs as Stan is playing on bloody Saturday afternoon's now.... we will be applying for tickets on Thursday at 1pm for the Arsenal game if they're still on sale to gold members!!
Meet you then if you are going? I will be able to get tickets for the Arsenal end if not as a couple of mates are season ticket holders but I don't know if I really want to go in their end and sitting on my hands.... I suppose I'll be surrounded by other Leeds supporters though!! 👍🙈🤣😉
Really top notch MDT that Mr TC squire.
Good personal tales from days of yore.
Are you going to this game TC , meet you for a jar or 2 pre or post match if you are.
I'm pretty confident we will win this, 2-0 ish. The old flow is coming back in to our play.
Leeds Leeds Leeds
🤣🤣🤣
Excellent TC a vastly improved effort, top job mate.
seeing as the game wont kick off until 16th October even my long range weather forecast apparatus cant see that far, early indications are by the way the grass is growing it will be mild for the time of year but no brolly need as it wont rain that weekend.
If the game was on this weekend id be confident of bagging another 3 points but seeing as those dreaded internationals are on anything could happen, players picking up injuries, having to self isolate, etc
This MDT could go into the history books with 623123123324534523 views, and might be on page 23 with all the comments (and thats BEFORE) the game kicks off😉
Better MDT than your first effort. I assume you were sober this time. I dont mind it being so early as England V Andorra hardly excites.
I can now spend a bit of time thinking about a real game that matters.
I wish you luck my friend and please ensure you seek out the Gaelic Bull God to ensure we have the luck of the leprechauns this game too.
Saints will press us high up the pitch so we need to be able to pass/break between their lines. Rodrigo looks a more complete striker than young Pat so I would expect him to keep his place with Hattrick on the bench if he has recovered enough.
Baby Shacks has earned the RB spot. Ayling might soon be wondering if he will ever get a game again.
Llorente is immense which is a shame for Charlie.
We wont have Rafa for this game as he will no doubt have to self isolate or, with the travel time, not be quite match fit to start. James looked more than decent on the left v Watford so maybe Jackie will then start on the right.
Expect Dallas to be fit as he is a warrior. If not I would put Bate in there and play him alongside KP. Both as No6s but given the licence to move into a No8 position as and when whilst the other one holds. Similar to England with KP and Rice.
Saints have pace up top as did Watford but Ward-Prowse will be a big miss for them.
ward Prowse got sent off yesterday so will be suspended,which is a big bonus for us.
Does Rafa have to quarantine if he plays for Brazil?
For crying out load TC. Half our team will have retired before we actually kick off.
Doesn't matter who we put out, Southampton will try hard and give us a good game, but ultimately let us have the 3 points, so I'm going 2-1 Leeds
Jeez, I didn't realise that this game is 2wks away as England are playing a massive game v the ski instructor's and waiters from Andorra next weekend.... this makes this the earliest MDT ever and will be long forgotten about by the time of the game.
Nothing goes on in Southampton so I'll add bits in the following days, bore you with a couple of stories about the place and make the rest up....
I played at Southampton's old ground, The Dell, in the Hampshire Senior Cup Final and it was the worst pitch ever and full of big holes and divots....don't know how Le Tissier looked so good on it! And we got stuffed 3-0!
I went to a Southampton v Leeds game about 20yrs ago but wasn't able to get tickets....we went down to our hotel anyway as it was booked. We got the ferry over to the Isle of Wight for a day trip and when we got back to the hotel the Leeds players coach was in the car park... we went in and the Leeds players were everywhere in tracksuits! After a couple of drinks I got brave and politely asked a table of players if anyone had any spare tickets. Dom Matteo said he had 2 and handed them over free and we sat with the players wives etc.... can't remember the score though!
Next morning as we came out of our hotel door for breakfast, Milner and Bakke came out of the room opposite and we went down in the lift with them. I remember Milner was very spotty and shy and Bakke had fkn massive ears....
I remember Viduka oddly sitting at a table by himself reading a newspaper. I'm sure Ivan Bravo was also there who I think got caught up with employing someone to kill somebody for him a couple of years ago.... is that correct or just the voices in my head!?
Southampton is famous for :
The Titanic sailing from here on it's fateful maiden voyage....
Onions were invented here....
The Spitfire plane was built here....
There are 8 other Southamptons in the world.... 6 in the USA and 2 in Canada. If you are travelling to the game make sure you put the right one in your sat nav....
Famous people from Southampton include:
Tit touching sexcase Benny Hill....
Some of the Chuckle Brothers....
Craig David who met a girl on Monday, took her for drink on Tuesday and was riding her on the Wednesday....
3 footed pilot Douglas Bader....
John Terry's best mate Wayne Bridge....
Non bra wearer Charlie Dimmock....
Howard Jones who'd like to get to know you well....
Jona Lewie who you'd find in a kitchen at party's....
Fat arrssed Luke Shaw who needs to find some shorts that fit....
It looked like we were back to last seasons form v WatfordScum so I'm going for a positive 3-0 victory with a Hattrick Bamford hat trick. I assume he'll be fit as the game is 2wks away and I think Bielsa will put him straight back in. If he'd have been fit yesterday I'm sure we'd have won by 3/4 and he'd have scored a couple....